Deepdave

2 minutes ago, philo said:

So here is my political statement: There are people who have found that they can influence others to take their statements as their truth over observable facts...things that they can see for themselves. What these people have learned is that when the question is asked: "Who do you believe...me or you lying eyes?" ...that a large percentage of people will choose to believe them over their own. Those who decide to practice this trade craft can have an instant following. What a rush for them. There has been academic studies to help understand this phenomenon. The short answer is that many people want, or need, a charismatic leader that they can follow, so they won't have to do the work to figure out shit. These people are the ones who tend to gravitate towards cults. Please do not underestimate the power of this movement and these "leaders". The best at this craft now run whole countries...and the most notorious have caused people to commit mass suicides. So, it is not unexpected to see examples of people with this hunger on this forum.

So what does this have to do with Martina and Alberto?  You have gone a little off topic.

13 minutes ago, philo said:

It is truly an amazing time that we live in when an argument about truth is deemed political.

You called it political, not me. "It's people like this who are getting elected to political office nowadays."   

1 minute ago, philo said:

Just to point out to our fellow forum members who choses to refute what everyone can clearly see and make their own judgement about and to ask them to help me understand why someone would do something so stupid. 

Someone explained it to you.  Was that not good enough?  They did not tell you that you were wrong to question it.  What esle do you want?

20 hours ago, philo said:

Will someone please look at camera #4 at 00:01 and tell me what that was?

So now that you pointed this out, what did you see that was so significant that you needed to rant and rave about political views?  I don't see anyone trying to refute what you saw or call you a liar.  You saw what you saw and now what?

8 minutes ago, philo said:

You seem to have a reading comprehension problem...but I'm sure I'm not the first one to point that out to you. I find no joy in focusing on one's handicap status so I will leave you with the last word. 

Thank you for giving me the last word.  You are definitely a fair person for allowing me this honour.

15 minutes ago, philo said:

Observers of this conversation will note that I made no reference AT ALL about sex in my description of the sleeping behaviors of Martina and the female. The observations I made cannot be refuted as they are reviewable by all on replay (and I gave the timestamp). You made up the sexual reference and the only reason one resorts to making up shit is to gain attention for themselves.

The only reason you have brought up the your whole observation is to infer a sexual connotation or there would not be a purpose for this conversation in the first place,  Since you started the conversation you are the one that is trying to gain attention for himself.  I am responding and am also trying to gain attention.

23 minutes ago, philo said:

I have also wondered why of all Martina's visitors, the only one that she goes alone to the patio with for 20-30 minute smoke breaks is the Big Guy? 

Martina does not go onto the patio with very many people, except Alberto. We very rarely see Martina smoke.  She does not smoke in the apartment.  So if a friend comes over, the only place to smoke is on the patio.  You, again, want to imply that she is having her pussy eaten when they are on the patio.  Very unlikely, as you have never seen Martina go naked or semi-clothed onto the patio due to probable anti-nudity laws in public in Spain (except perhaps at the beach)

21 minutes ago, philo said:

I have seen Martina display the same physical contact avoidance with the Big Guy. This seems strange to me because the first time I ever watched this apartment was when I saw her jump into his arms and straddle him. I was not familiar with Martina and I thought the Big Guy was Alberto until I was corrected by forum members. Since then there has been a virtual no contact policy.

You continue to comment on this phenomenon that Martina "straddled" the "Big Guy" (whose name is Dani).  It is obvious that this was not done as sexual manoeuvre but as a "hey it's great to see you and I am so happy, I want a big hug".  No more sexual connotation.   

34 minutes ago, philo said:

I continue to be amazed by the belief system that some people have that goes "if I did no see it, then it could not have happened. I would love to live next door to a couple, with an attractive wife, where the husband had that belief.

Your belief system is faulty.  You are saying that "If you did not see it, then it must have happened" or you would not have said it in the first place.  Sorry, but if you did not see it, then anything could have happened, but most likely nothing.

35 minutes ago, philo said:

Could it be that the woman Martina is in bed with now is the other female partner referenced? They seem to have history sleeping together as the other woman straddled Martina's thigh during their sleep. Later, after Martina changed sides at 11:56, the woman again attempted to straddle Martina's ass but was shaken off...all during their sleeping. 

Your observation that this visitor likes to straddle Martina when sleeping and Martina does not straddle while sleeping may simply be her sleeping preference, and nothing sexual.  I do not believe that i have ever seen Marttina and Alberto straddle while sleeping.  In fact Martina often wants her own sleeping space and that is perhaps the reason that we see Martina and Alberto sleep in different areas of the apartment.  It's a sleeping preference, not a sexual preference.  The visitor, on the other hand, may like to straddle with her partner. So goes a possible explanation.

9 minutes ago, FrankZabba said:

whoa, slow down there skippy, now you are starting to make some sense.

Who or what is a skippy?  Isn't skippy a peanut butter?

3 hours ago, Deepdave said:

You have forgotten that Nelly has drug and alcohol problems.  When she has problems she is not very nice.  It is Martina's good heart to try to help her that she continues to maintain this friendship.  But I do not think Alberto likes Nelly because he remembers that Nelly is a bad influence on Martina.  As long as Nelly and Martina stay away from drugs and booze, when they get together, their friendship will work.  But normally Nelly's sobriety does not last long and when that happens she becomes nasty.  I hope Alberto can convince Martina to keep her friendship as a secondary priority because school is starting soon and Martina has to focus on her future, not trying to make Nelly happy.  I don't think she can do both at the same time..  

Wow, I really got the forum going.  First, there is no doubt that Nelly has a drug and alcohol problem.  When she is severely intoxicated she becomes incoherent and throws up all over the place.  If you had a subscription you would actually see it happen.  That is nasty.  I did not mean that she was verbally nasty, although she has stomped off and disappeared when she has had arguments with Martina.  These arguments have been clearly seen on RLC in the past.  These are not my imagination.  The past sexual encounters between Martina and Nelly (specifically in the parking lot, involved significant drunkedness to the point where Martina was also incoherent).  It is my understanding that when they do not get drunk, they do not fuck.  This fact comes from one of the trusted translators.  But most of the trash talkers do not believe the translators so that is why your wrath should fall upon me for saying suck a terrible thing.  Martina will see the light with Alberto's help.  She will succeed at school and get out of this "rathole" called RLC.  I call it a "rathole" because it is not a normal life.  They have tried their best to portray a normal life, but it is far from normal.  I repeat, Martina and Alberto, will escape "us" together and have a great life in the future.  Right now they are just entertaining us and giving us something to write and talk about on a daily basis.  

12 minutes ago, philo said:

In addition to being extremely sexually compatible, Martina and Nelly apparently are intellectually compatible. Martina has a different quality of conversation with Nelly than she can have with Alberto. She probably also admires Nelly for her many talents...including her language skills, her musical talents, and her humor. Martinas admiration was most evident when they spent hours just kissing and when Martina performed the most intimate services of eating Nelly's ass.

You have forgotten that Nelly has drug and alcohol problems.  When she has problems she is not very nice.  It is Martina's good heart to try to help her that she continues to maintain this friendship.  But I do not think Alberto likes Nelly because he remembers that Nelly is a bad influence on Martina.  As long as Nelly and Martina stay away from drugs and booze, when they get together, their friendship will work.  But normally Nelly's sobriety does not last long and when that happens she becomes nasty.  I hope Alberto can convince Martina to keep her friendship as a secondary priority because school is starting soon and Martina has to focus on her future, not trying to make Nelly happy.  I don't think she can do both at the same time..  

1 hour ago, emnv said:

Sorry to correct you, she was playing Fortnite and then talking on the phone all night long with her brother Guillem. Always in Spanish.

With her friend Lluis she speaks Valencian, never Spanish.

Thanks for correcting me.  Hey Berty, it just further shows that there is no torid love affair going on in these late night calls.

7 minutes ago, berty_47 said:

Thanks you BubbaG for your info. I didn't notice this fraud by Martina.
However, Martina made a big mistake: she didn't know that Alberto had just woken up and noticed that she wasn't in bed yet.

4:53 am Alberto woke up and goes to the bathroom.
4:54 Alberto back in bed and checked with his arm if Martina is in bed, the bed was empty.
4:55 Martina sneaks into bed and pretends to be asleep.
4:58 Alberto wakes up, Martina strokes him.
4:59 Alberto kisses her and stands up.

What an idiot. Interesting to see how Martina cheats on him
and how he reacts to this botched trick.

Hi Berty & Bubba

The two of you are such trash talkers.  Martina was up last night primarily because she is having trouble sleeping.  So she was playing games with her brother (for a while), then Luis.  You have decided that she is having a torrid love affair over the phone with a gay guy.  Good luck. They are good friends and that’s all.  Alberto knows that Martina is having sleep problems and he understands. She went to bed to see him before he left for work.  She even got up and spoke to him some more. Martina is working through some difficult personal problems but she is smart and along with Alberto will work them out. I think that it’s fun that Martina is reading about money.  I think she intends to make a lot of money and reading books about money does not hurt. It won’t be long before Martina & Alberto do not need RLC and they will leave.  Then you will have to find someone else to trash.

2 minutes ago, Noldus said:

Breakfast in Barcelona 🙂  

1 minute ago, darkman said:

bueno si mi razonamiento es equivocado , todos los actores y famosos estan equivocados , quitando a sakira , cheer , y alguna mas la regla es señor de 50 chica de 30 .

Why don't you just enjoy watching them fuck rather than creating fantasies that could be interpreted 150 different ways as you have agreed.  Her meeting a boy 5 years ago does not mean anything except in your dreams.

54 minutes ago, darkman said:

sus trabajos que le sirven ademas de para ganar algo extra, para relacionarse, mi opinion es que los consigue a traves de los rusos de rlf, son RTES en el puerto olimpico y sitios muy turisticos discotecas y bares musicales , negocios de inversion rusa , la relacion con nelly, en la cual ella se refleja, esa es la atraccion que siente, (le gustaria ser como nelly) viajar, ver cosas, otros mundos, y al lado de alberto eso es imposible, pero ahora mismo le hace falta, no puede dejarlo, aunque estaria muy bien un apartamento solo con martina y sus amigos, tipo leora, al final, tienen una vida muy diferente del comun de los mortales. El tiempo dirá, pero creo que estamos en la fase final. esa es la atraccion que siente, (le gustaria ser como nelly) viajar, ver cosas, otros mundos, y al lado de alberto eso es imposible, pero ahora mismo le hace falta, no puede dejarlo, aunque estaria muy bien un apartamento solo con Martina y sus amigos, tipo leora, al final tienes una vida muy diferente en la comunidad de los mortales. El tiempo dirá, pero creo que estamos en la fase final. esa es la atraccion que siente, (le gustaria ser como nelly) viajar, ver cosas, otros mundos, y al lado de alberto eso es imposible, pero ahora mismo le hace falta, no puede dejarlo, aunque estaria muy bien un apartamento solo con Martina y sus amigos, tipo leora, al final tienes una vida muy diferente en la comunidad de los mortales. El tiempo dirá, pero creo que estamos en la fase final.

Sorry Darkman.  You must have been a bit tipsy last night.  You repeated yourself at least 3 times - over and over and over.  You also have a Nelly fetish.  Too bad.  Get sober.

15 minutes ago, chema said:

@Deepdave comment peux-tu me connaitre mieux, puisque tu ne me connais pas du tout. Non je ne suis pas un ami de cette chose, je ne vois que ce qu'elle est vraiment. C'est mon avis et tu as le droit de ne pas partager mon opinion. 

Your hate is so unnaturally strong.  Good luck with your bad feeling.

Notre haine est si anormalement forte. Bonne chance avec votre mauvais pressentiment.

11 minutes ago, chema said:

Martina n'est qu'une petite salope manipulatrice qui prend les gens pour des cons. Il est grand temps qu'Alberto tape du poing sur la table et lui mette les points sur les I. Je ne peux tout simplement plus la supporter. Ennuyeuse, raide, elle ne sait que dormir. Elle se prend pour une bonne danseuse mais ne sait pas danser. Au pieu, elle est très médiocre. Inintéressante sur toute la ligne. Qu'elle dégage une fois pour toutes. Alberto, tu perds ton temps avec cette poufiasse, il est temps que tu penses à toi sinon tu risques de ne pas t'en sortir avec cette pseudo femme qui te prend pour son joujou.  

Wow - you have a real hate on for Martina.  If I didn't know better you sound like a person who use to be a very good friend of hers and is no longer and now you miss her.

Wow - vous avez une vraie haine pour Martina. Si je ne te connaissais pas mieux, tu ressembles à une personne qui était une très
 bonne amie à elle et qui ne l'est plus et maintenant elle te manque.

4 hours ago, JenniferMom said:

I am involved in this forum because it is a distraction from the doldrums of everyday life.  Perhaps too I am challenged by trying to follow your convoluted logic.  For example , we both have moral problems?  Then the next sentence is we don't have moral problems?  Which is it?

I don't disagree with anything you have said.  Of course Martina and Alberto love each other and are very close.  Yes someday they will leave RLC.  All of this is fine.

To me the critical question is whether or not Martina is having sex beyond Alberto.  Forget about morals and emotions, this is pretty much a fact-based question.  You seem to think the answer to this is NO.  In fact, you are rather convinced of this.   I and others here are not convinced.  This is truly is a question where we may have to agree to disagree.  Note that I am not saying she is having sex with someone else other than Alberto.  I simply don't know for a fact.  But the circumstantial evidence is damning IMHO.

Again, strip away the moral conversation and the emotions.  If she is NOT having sex beyond Alberto, good for her.  If she IS having sex beyond Alberto, good for her.  I simply do not care because she is a strong woman and she is doing what is in her best interest, regardless.

Some might wonder why the obsession over this and perhaps they have a point.  I would say I am not obsessed over whether Martina is having sex without Alberto.  But perhaps I do have an obsession ... and unhealthy one at that.  Perhaps I am more obsessed over why you think it is not happening.

My point is that there are certian contributors to the forum who consider Martina as immoral because she is bi-sexual and she, according to them, cheats on Alberto.  My further point is that these contributors are immoral becasue they are both voyeurs on RLC and therefore themselves are immoral.

Jen - I neither think that you or I are immoral.  We do not condemn Martina and Alberto for their lifestyle.  It is their's to choose and be happy.  If Alberto is not upset about Martina's friendship with Nelly and is aware of this friendship (whether sexual or not) it is not cheating.  Bogdan, on the other hand, did not want them to continue to have a sexual relationship and if Nelly persisted with a sexual relationship then it would be cheating.

Secondly, I have not indicated that Martina is not be having other sexual activities wih othe women.  If she is, Alberto would be OK with them if he were aware of them.  But I believe that he would not be happy if she had sex with another man.  If she did, that would be cheating. 

33 minutes ago, JenniferMom said:

Sorry Dave I think you are the one with the moral problems.  You described their relationship perfectly … “he cannot stop her” … yet you are the one painting her as a goody two shoes when she stays out all night.  I actually am quite fine with her relationship to Alberto as I never believed it is much more than a casual sexual relationship.  I do not judge her.

Honestly don’t understand how you can say she has an open relationship and sex is an amusement and then tell us that nothing happens in her all night partying.

 

 

Why do you get involved in this forum.  I think it's fun that we both have moral problems.  But the difference is that our moral problem is not a problem.  It is entertainment.  Martina and Alberto are entertainers.  But I believe that dispite what I have said about them, they do love each other and they do have a goal in life.  They will be gone form RLC soon because they will not need to entertain us any longer.  They know exactly what they are doing.  Wish them luck for their future becasue they will be succesful together witout us.

1 hour ago, JenniferMom said:

Emmett is not saying everyone is a liar, he is just skeptical and doesn’t believe everything he hears.  This is a prudent way to live in my opinion.  How do you get through life believing everything you hear?

OMG, by your own definition Martina IS a cheater and she has cheated on Alberto multiple times with Nelly.  This is indisputable.  What is disputable is whether she continues to cheat on Alberto.

If I were you I would stick with your belief that they have an open relationship and if Martina sees someone that she wants to fuck, she has Alberto’s blessing.   I am pretty sure you have said many times here that “their relationship works for them”.  On this, you and I are in complete agreement.

You want us to believe only what we see on cam and what you decide to share with us.  Sorry if I am not going to go along with that.

Martina is not a cheater.  Because of their open relationship, sex is an amusement.  She has sex with other women, but it is physical not emotional (except Nelly who got more involved with Martina until Brogdan protested).  Alberto does not stop her as long as she tells him.  He can not stop her anyway.  She has her bi-sexual sex and then she fucks the shit out of Alberto and vice versa.  The problem is all in our minds. We deem them to have their moral problems but then we have our own moral problems by watching them plus being intrigued by any off-cam action that we can fantacize.  Their goal is to make us believe that they are being bad.  That's what makes them even more interesting to all of us.

By the way, I renewed my subscription.

53 minutes ago, EMMETT111 said:

okay i made a point about how a man can live with a woman 20 years and not know she is banging his best friend ,and related that to how these guys on here just know for sure that Martina is a saint off cam and how they could be just as clueless as the 20 year husband was my point

 

You read a story about a man who was cheated on by his wife and automatically assumed that Martina is also a cheater.  There is no doubt that things can happen off-cam that could make you doubt the authenticity of Martina but you can only judge what you can see, not what you make up or fantasize.  You only know about the woman cheating on her husband becasue you have been told that it's happening, otherwise you would never know.  Your point does not hold water and therefore has no applicability here.

4 minutes ago, EMMETT111 said:

too funny,i have been reading a shit load of stories over on Reddit how all these guys have been married to a woman for 20 years and had no idea they been screwing their best friend for 10 years,but you guys on here think you know everything about Martina's morals and what she does off cam because of what she comes home and tells Al on cam LOL

So what you are saying is that you can’t trust anyone.  Everyone is a liar.  How do you get through life thinking that everything everyone tells you is a lie?

13 minutes ago, JenniferMom said:

I think only the premium $20 per year members get the names. 

Thank you.  I let my subscription go but I may renew now.