StnCld316 Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 Just now, Amy3 said: On what grounds? Try to be specific. Just calling him an idiot won't do. I don't know on what grounds but the Democrats and some withing his own Party Ranks will think of something that will put the finishing touches on him. He's not a very likeable guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maturin Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 5 minutes ago, Amy3 said: On what grounds? Try to be specific. Just calling him an idiot won't do. https://impeachdonaldtrumpnow.org/case-for-impeachment/grounds-for-impeachment/ Any one of these would do for any other president. But purely on a diplomatic level, he's turned America into a laughing stock, even worse than W. managed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amy3 Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 I said specifically! If you can't come up with an actual crime, you're just dreaming. Listen, I think Trump is an idiot too! I think Hillary was actually worse, though, because it was very clear that she was running a clandestine sub-Government that funneled money into her own clandestine system and was designed to undermine this country. She and her ilk are one world globalists, who think they can manage a socialist utopian fantasy land. The truth is that they are all corrupt beyond belief. So, while Trump may be an idiot, he is not the center of a cabal hell bent on enslaving us all under a one world Government. For that reason, I'd rather take my chances with an idiot. Sorry, I know you vehemently disagree, but it's how I see it so there! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBsq69 Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 1 minute ago, Amy3 said: She and her ilk are one world globalists, who think they can manage a socialist utopian fantasy land. Hilary Clinton, a socialist ... if she was then Bernie Sanders would hardly be against her. I do remember she lost to Obama because she lied about what happened in Yugoslavia amongst other things. The Democrats should have chosen another candidate and not Sanders because he was too left wing to win in the US. But I agree with you unless the can concrete the claims about Russia there is nothing to impeach him on, terrible man that he is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amy3 Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 17 minutes ago, BBsq69 said: Hilary Clinton, a socialist ... if she was then Bernie Sanders would hardly be against her. I do remember she lost to Obama because she lied about what happened in Yugoslavia amongst other things. The Democrats should have chosen another candidate and not Sanders because he was too left wing to win in the US. But I agree with you unless the can concrete the claims about Russia there is nothing to impeach him on, terrible man that he is. Yes, a socialist! She didn't come out like Bernie, because it wasn't in her interest to be so visibly solcialist. She needs some of that middel ground where the traditional John F Kennedy type liberals live. She could never win if she showed her true colors. It's very evident to me that she was the head of a clandestine society of policital insiders, whose aim is to create a one world Government that they can cotrol. I'll vote for an idiot over that any day. Her private server is all th evidence one needs to prove this point. She purposefully skirted the visible Government so that she could run her operations under the table unnoticed. While Trump is an idiot, Hillary is evil. That was the choice we were given. Take your pick. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 I really wonder what you know about real socialism, which you have never experienced in the U.S. Maybe you think that those who do not agree with the Republicans and want to improve social welfare for the millions of poor Americans. must be socialists. Very strange. Maybe you mix socialists with socialdemocrats, but you do not have even them in your country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maturin Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 6 minutes ago, kalevipoeg said: I really wonder what you know about real socialism, which you have never experienced in the U.S. Maybe you think that those who do not agree with the Republicans and want to improve social welfare for the millions of poor Americans. must be socialists. Very strange. Maybe you mix socialists with socialdemocrats, but you do not have even them in your country. There really is no point talking about what socialism actually is in this thread mate. When Bernie Sanders is called far left then you know that you're fighting against a elite-skewed Overton window that they've brought upon themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amy3 Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 47 minutes ago, kalevipoeg said: I really wonder what you know about real socialism, which you have never experienced in the U.S. Maybe you think that those who do not agree with the Republicans and want to improve social welfare for the millions of poor Americans. must be socialists. Very strange. Maybe you mix socialists with socialdemocrats, but you do not have even them in your country. I asked Venezuela and they told me all about how this well intentioned socialistic ideologies always turn out in the end. Want me to have them contact you? They can tell you all about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amy3 Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 This is exactly how socialism ends ever single time. Here's an example from Brazil. I can post videos and images of the demise of Venezuala if you like. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maturin Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 12 minutes ago, Amy3 said: This is exactly how socialism ends ever single time. Here's an example from Brazil. I can post videos and images of the demise of Venezuala if you like. Except every other Western democratic country. Ask Germany, UK, Scandinavia, France, Italy, Spain - Jesus too many to name, ask them how ther paid holiday, collective worker bargaining, health care that's free at the point of need, health and saftey regulation, living wage, state pension, maternity leave for both parents, need I go on? I think you'll find that democratic socialism is working a heck of a lot better than you realise. If you define the "failiure" of socialism as the nascent attempts by South American countries to follow the European model that are systematically infiltrated and crushed by the US secret services and overt US economic bullying every time, then as I keep saying, I don't think you understand what socialism is. I don't know whether to laugh or cry when I see posts like this cheering about how you are allowing the hypercapitalists in your country to completely fuck you over whilst they ensure that neighbouring countries are unable to follow a different path. What a world we live in :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amy3 Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 Those countries you listed are not socialist countries. They all, in fact, operate on a free market capitalistic system. I define socialism as the systemic takeover by a Government to own and control the nations economy. I think that's a pretty good definition off the top of my head. I have no doubt that this is what the left ultimately wants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBsq69 Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 46 minutes ago, Amy3 said: I have no doubt that this is what the left ultimately wants. Are you Russ Limburg? Because let me tell you this, Hilary Clinton is seen as part of the defenders of the capitalist system by the Corbynites in the UK who would rather Trump won than Hilary. Yes they are largely an ignorant bunch of people (and there are certainly those within that group who would love to bring everything under state control - I am referring specifically to Momentum who are like Labour's Tea Party) but they would not call Hilary one of their own ever. Corbyn almost won the last election in the UK and is a friend of Venezuela. Calling the French free market capitalists is something they would regard as quite an insult although Macron does seem to want to lead them that way now. The Labour governments of the 40s, 60s and 70s were all well to the left of anything that exists now and if you had dared claim they weren't socialists they probably ask you to step outside the pub, even the women. Certainly the 45-50 Labour government is having achieved the most in UK history. PS I don't find many of Corbyn's policies of renationalisation of many parts of the economy a bad thing at all, but he has surrounded himself with some dubious people, and while he doesn't seem to openly encourage the bullying of detractors like Trump does seem to do, he certainly has made no serious effort to condemn them. His foreign policy is basically anti-American and saying he would refuse to press the button at the same time as his party's policy of maintaining a nuclear deterrent is asinine. He is avowedly socialist and while he would say not, is certainly a member of the hard left while the leaders of Momentum who claim to be is fan club are out and out Communists, who for the last 30 years would not have been let near the Labour Party. Whatever you might say the dictionary definition is, Socialism is a broad church but the famous (notorious) Clause 4 of the Labour Party which related to the aim of bringing things into public ownership does not mean Communism. Blair quite rightly got rid of it because it is dogma. I don't think he would call himself a socialist because he wasn't but I daresay Gordon Brown would (call himself i mean not Blair) and he was a much feted Chancellor for 10 years - in the US you don't really have an equivalent because the Chancellor is almost as powerful as the Prime Minister. Anyway Hilary is not a socialist and neither was Obama or Bill. In any other Western country they would have been to the right of centre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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